cap_ironman | question/discussion: Sam Wilson aka, Falcon

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question/discussion: Sam Wilson aka, Falcon

It seemed to me this post is withing acceptable guidelines, b-but still a bit nervous. Hello, fellow community members. I'm currently writing an alternate universe Steve/Tony fic in which Sam Wilson/Falcon is a prominent supporting character, but unfortunately I haven't read enough canon he appears in.

So, if anyone has thoughts/characterization tips (or even recs for comics he appears in, though I can't vouch being able to find them if they aren't online somewhere) regarding Sam, I'd be very grateful if you could share them. Since it's an AU (set in medieval times) I'm especially interested in his personality, as that's not something I can read about on wiki very much. :')

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Mod says this is totally on-topic. :)

For Sam characterisation, consider looking at

gloss's fic; she doesn't write Steve/Tony, but she writes a fair bit of Sam and I really like it. (Obviously it's always best to go straight to canon for your characterisation, but if it's not available I think her fic is the next best thing!)

Thanks, I'll look them up. :)

Other mod, who is not really here, also says it's on topic.

Other mod really likes Sam.

Okay, here's the problem with Sam. He can be an awesome character, but in the '70s he got a RetCon Of Doom, and was made less awesome, canon since the '70s has dealt with that to vary degrees of success.

Personally, I really enjoy his original origin story in the early days of Captain America and the Falcon, the Stan Lee issues. Avoid Englehart for Sam (Or Peggy, or Sharon). I also liked him in the Mad Bomb/Roller Derby issues (Cap #193-214). It still had a bit of the evil retcon, but he and Steve had a nice snarky vibe going. I've enjoyed Brubaker's Sam, though I find he's a little too... supportive I guess. Like I tend to like him better when he's more directly challenging Steve, not antagonistic really, but not just there to provide hugs when needed. Sam and Bucky had a hilarious dynamic too. So I'd rec the Brubaker stuff for Sam, even though Sharon is terrible in it.

That's all I can think of for now. Hope it helps

I read about that retcon earlier while I was reading articles about the character, and it sounded... rather obviously terrible. I just can't see what the author was even thinking. I'3 Not that I know much about writing poc characters, which is why I've been researching the subject to prepare to write this particular fic, but even to me that sounds pretty obviously racist. I'3

I'll try to keep an eye out for that stuff. Though, like I said I live in Finland where a lot of stuff is either not available at all or only available in very few places and/or expensive. I it's all probably somewhere online but it's... harder to concentrate on reading comics on the screen, somehow. Anyway, after putting together the info I got in answers here I hope I have a better idea what sort of person he is/could be in the story.

Sounds like he's usually an independent person who won't take people being stupid without challenging it. And occasionally kind of snarky? One thing I wonder about... I understand he's also an atheist in canon (is that only a thing since the Retcon of doom/ is it still maintained?). I'd been pondering about his religion in the AU since it's something rather important in the medieval setting and in the story he's from Egypt, where there were both coptic christians and muslims according to what I've read... anyway, how important part of his character would you say that is?

But he drifted away from it, because his parents died in terrible circumstances, and it soured him on religion for a while (iirc, my memory is terrible). His parents were pretty open minded when it came to religion, I think Sam might have been raised Baptist, but it didn't stick. He's respectful of religion, but no where near as hung up on religion as Steve can be at turns.

I think Sam tends to be impatient and isn't one to suffer fools gladly rather than being snarky. His speech can be pretty pointed.

A lot of that run was really terrible. It would have been so bad if people didn't keep bring it up. I like that Brubaker just pretends it never happened.

Yeah, I think you can get the Lee run in Captain America Essential, but the rest might be pricey trades. I like Book Depository for some of that stuff, brings the prices down a bit.

Sam does have a sense of humour, but it's more deadpan than anything else. Like he's not in your face snarky like Clint his, it's more of a statement of fact and letting the truth speak for itself.

I was thinking about Sam and Steve after I wrote that last (I only get Internet a couple times a week), and it seems to me that Sam is almost more of an idealist than Steve is. Because Steve has this American Dream thing going, and he tries to make everyone live up to it, and sure he has a lot of compassion for people who can't or don't or have lost hope along the way, but if things go too far off track he sulks mightily about how things shouldn't be that way. Whereas Sam knows that the world is going to disappoint him, and keep disappointing him, and he's just kind of gets on with trying to make it better. He doesn't have a lot of patience for Steve's sulking though.

I think Sam is a practical man. If you're writing in a time when everyone is religious because everyone is, he'll probably have the state religion from wherever he's from. I could see him as Muslim more than Coptic, but I don't think it really matters to his story. He's long since gotten over his teenaged angry at god so I'm not believing in him thing. Now he's just kind of low-level atheist, and it doesn't figure into the plot at all really.

I really liked him when he was working with Bucky during Bucky's run as Cap. He was a mentor and also a friend. It was a nice balance. I don't have the exact issue numbers, but the Bucky-as-Cap era is fairly short, so he's easy to find (it also has bonus Natasha, which is never a bad thing).

I might take a look at that run if/when I come across it, thanks for the tip. :)

If you can get the early trades of Captain America (after Steve comes out of the ice), Sam is pretty hard core. In that, he speaks truth to power, and has some pretty harsh things to say about his country, but he likes his country enough to keep on trucking. Sam is a proud man, like, not cutting off his nose to spite his face proud, but proud enough. For instance, when he was offered a place on the Avengers to join their team, he turned it down because he didn't know if it was due to his own merits, or because of Affirmative Action (because the Avengers team was rather white, iirc, and they were trying to make it not so much so).

In addition, even though he knows that the world sees him as an appendage to Steve, Sam takes great pains to point out that he's his own person in the Civil War series, Sam was all, "I am not his sidekick!"

Relationship wise, Sam and Steve are pretty close. Sam speaks truth to power, and just like Tony, he isn't cowed by the August presence that is Steve₁. Steve seems to like Sam in that Sam is plain speaking.

Sam gets on with Steve, Bucky and was a source of comfort to Sharon when Steve died. Sam and Steve are close, as evidenced during the Civil War (sorry, mainlined that series over the weekend, so it's fresh in my mind), when Sam was the only one who knew where Steve's secret meeting place was. Sam and Tony don't like each other, and rarely share the same page, but Sam and Steve are very close.

I did a bit of meta here (http://jazzypom.livejournal.com/56915.html#cutid1). I do like Ultimates Sam over 616 Sam, true, but I think their personalities are similar enough in the comics, although their origins are different. Sam in all forms is a pretty intense guy, I feel.

₁ ^{In that, Steve Rogers and Captain America are so interlinked people tend to be awed by the man/legend and default to him more than they should do, at times}

There are writers who do Sam/Steve. I think

harmonyangel is one. I don't know if her fic is flocked, but she has an AO3 account.

gloss writes a lot of Sam Wilson fic. Not necessarily Sam/Steve (although there is that), but her stuff is well written, no matter which way you slice it. I'd say, if you can't get a hold of 616 Sam, I'd say 1610 Ultimates Sam is similar enough (intense and very proud) - but Ults Sam is a scientist and a former member of the armed reserves, whereas 616 Sam was a pimp (Marvel was in a bad place in the 1970s) before he became a social worker.

I think in order to write Steve and Sam versus Steve and Tony, you have to realise that Steve likes each guy for his own merits, and Steve isn't one to compare the two. I've noticed that anyway - if either guy (Sam or Tony) tries to object to the other's presence in Steve's life, Steve just doesn't... go there.

I just read the meta you linked, and it was very interesting and informative, thanks a lot for the link.

When it comes to Sam/Steve I can completely see why people would ship it, but unfortunately I tend to be kind of a ship monogamist (with some exceptions, and also some of my ships are polyamorous but anyway) so... I think if I read fic I might kind of avoid that. :'3

"I think in order to write Steve and Sam versus Steve and Tony, you have to realise that Steve likes each guy for his own merits, and Steve isn't one to compare the two."

That's good to know, I was wondering how that would work out, since in the story I'm writing Sam is actually the first (and pretty much only, for a while) person Steve meets in a strange country and time, and as such he might place quite a lot of weight on his opinion. On the other hand, even if he seems to have some abandonment issues at times, Steve also seems rather... pigheaded? :')

Do you know exactly why Sam dislikes Tony so much though? I'm asking mostly so I could work out if/how to convert that into the au verse.

Do you know exactly why Sam dislikes Tony so much though? I'm asking mostly so I could work out if/how to convert that into the au verse.

Sam dislikes Tony because Tony Stark tends to be high handed, and can be read as 'arrogant'. We might like Tony for his vulnerabilities, but in the comic verse, you have to know Tony to see what makes him weak. If you don't really know Tony, you can't see it. Most of the Avengers tend to think of Tony as being a dick though.

In the books, there's no big deal as to why Sam and Tony don't get on, so I pretty much treat it as them just not getting on, and the only thing they have in common is Steve, and that's all right.

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