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cap_ironman2008-04-28 10:14 am
crimsonquills.livejournal.com) wrote in cap_ironman2008-04-28 10:14 am
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casual conversation topics for Steve and Tony
This seems like a silly thing to post about, but I swear, it's one of my biggest tripping points when I'm writing certain stories. And I'm not writing a story currently that requires this, but I've been pondering it lately and thought it might be fun for people to speculate on. And hey, if it turns out to be a jumping off point for discussion, so much the better!
Anyway, here's the question I've been pondering...
If Steve and Tony were just hanging out, talking casually (i.e., not about the latest threat or any other Avengers business), what would they talk about?
Sports? If so, which ones? Books? What kind? I can't really see Tony reading much fiction... Movies? Throwaway canon comments suggest that Tony, at least, doesn't go to many. I'm certain they'd sometimes talk about politics and world events, but I think those discussions could get a little heavy for casual conversation. Would they have philosophical debates? About what ideas? I doubt either of them has much time for hobbies, but can you think of one that either of them might like enough to squeeze in a few minutes for here and there? (Well, aside from Steve's art and Tony's tinkering, which are obvious ones.) Would they gossip about their fellow superheros?
Brainstorm away!
Anyway, here's the question I've been pondering...
If Steve and Tony were just hanging out, talking casually (i.e., not about the latest threat or any other Avengers business), what would they talk about?
Sports? If so, which ones? Books? What kind? I can't really see Tony reading much fiction... Movies? Throwaway canon comments suggest that Tony, at least, doesn't go to many. I'm certain they'd sometimes talk about politics and world events, but I think those discussions could get a little heavy for casual conversation. Would they have philosophical debates? About what ideas? I doubt either of them has much time for hobbies, but can you think of one that either of them might like enough to squeeze in a few minutes for here and there? (Well, aside from Steve's art and Tony's tinkering, which are obvious ones.) Would they gossip about their fellow superheros?
Brainstorm away!
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And then there's the fact that Tony is such a ridonculous GEEK- I have no doubt he and Steve would argue endlessly over classic cars versus modern ones, snail mail versus the internet, the whole nine yards. I can't see Steve as a technophobe, though, more that he's convinced the old ways are... I don't know, less soulless, somehow?
Gossip? I can see Steve needing to know about the other heroes, especially the Avengers, because they're his family. Tony? Just loves gossip.
You know, for a non-Marvel fan, I actually spend an insane amount of time thinking about this pairing...
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The awesome part is that Steve is canonically a Tolkien fan. There's panel somewhere in either volume 1 Cap or volume 1 Avengers where he's mentally listing the greatest cultural accomplishments of the 20th century, and Tolien's on the list.
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I don't even like Tolkien (I know, blasphemy for an SF&F fan, but true) and this is still made of win. *grins* I think it must be in volume 1 Cap, because I've read all of the Avengers except Disassembled at this point and I haven't seen that scene. Unless it was a special or a mini, which is entirely possible.
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Ooooh, this is an excellent point! Depending on the story, Steve has probably discovered a lot himself, but still, decades worth of culture and history is impossible to totally catch up on.
I have no doubt he and Steve would argue endlessly over classic cars versus modern ones, snail mail versus the internet, the whole nine yards.
That could definitely be fun. *grins* And now my brain is trying to give me a love letter writing bunny. Argh, brain! I already have four stories in progress and one other that I'm just barely resisting starting by the skin of my teeth! *adds this one to the bunny hutch and hopes it'll be satisfied with that*
You know, for a non-Marvel fan, I actually spend an insane amount of time thinking about this pairing...
*g* If you're a non-Marvel fan, how did you find the pairing? (Possibly I should already know this, but my memory is like a sieve.)
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*nods* Living in India, I can definitely empathize a little with Steve's whole man-out-of-time thing- there's a HUGE amount of cultural references that y'all in the West take for granted that I wouldn't have the first clue about, and I'm pretty Westernized as it is.
*not-so-discreetly encourages the bunny* That would be five kinds of awesome, really. I could see it starting out completely platonic- say, with Tony going on about how much more convenient emails are, and Steve pointing out that he's never received an old-fashioned letter in his life, so how would he know? And the whole thing just going from there.
*pokes* It's all your fault, really. You added me to your fic-in-progress filter, and after that I decided there was no point fighting it. Funnily enough, I *still* don't like Marvel, especially Civil War and its aftermath. Steve and Tony in my head exist in a happy little AU where CW did not happen, Steve is still alive, and Tony is- well, he can't NOT be messed up and still be Tony, but I like to think he's on the saner side of messed up.
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India? Wow. I'm used to the Internet being awesomely internation, but I think this is the first time I've run into someone living in India.
I could see it starting out completely platonic- say, with Tony going on about how much more convenient emails are, and Steve pointing out that he's never received an old-fashioned letter in his life, so how would he know? And the whole thing just going from there.
I had it in my mind as an established relationship kind of thing, but you know, I think I could make it work as a first time fic, too. *g* With the letters slowly growing more personal, more intimate, both of them revealing things in text that it just wouldn't come to them to say in a normal conversation, and then the letters start trending into romantic areas... So sweet.
*pokes* It's all your fault, really. You added me to your fic-in-progress filter, and after that I decided there was no point fighting it.
*laughs* I'm happy to take the
blamecreditblame. *g*Funnily enough, I *still* don't like Marvel, especially Civil War and its aftermath.
I love Marvel and I don't like Civil War and its aftermath, either. *wry*
Steve and Tony in my head exist in a happy little AU where CW did not happen, Steve is still alive, and Tony is- well, he can't NOT be messed up and still be Tony, but I like to think he's on the saner side of messed up.
Hee! We're all right there in the happy AU with you. :-) :-) And hey, being with Steve really helps Tony be on the saner side of messed up!
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...
I need an 'Evil Enabler' icon of some sort...
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I think he would start that way, but as they got more intimate, he would start to want to put more into them, and once he gave in and wrote one by hand, it would be a quick slide into getting them perfect.
Not to mention what Pepper and the other Avengers would think of it...
I think Pepper would think it was wonderful. *g* The other Avengers would probably roll their eyes. And depending on when it was set and which Avengers were involved, might tease them to death for it. *g*
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Other things they talk about:
- motorcycles, aircraft, cars, basically everything with an engine (that Tony didn't build) - they both appreciate the beauty of a well-designed machine, especially when they go fast
- history - they totally wank about who their favourite historical characters are
- ancient armaments, and strategy - "Napoleon was so totally the greatest general of all time." "OMG NOE WAYZ!1"
- art (not Steve's) - Steve loves art, full stop; Tony is a collector
- music - Steve likes swing, big band, jazz; Tony likes rock, metal and little classical
- The Great Coffee Debate - how much is too much?
- philosophy - I need to brush up on my Steve canon. iirc he doesn't have an intense classical education, but being deeply philosophical by nature, he's have read all the great dead white dudes. Since being defrosted he's read some of the great lights of the past century. He's read way more critical socialist, feminist and postmodern stuff than has Tony, who has more of a business-school background. (imo, of course)
Would they gossip about their fellow superheros?
Kind of? They'd definitely discuss them, but I'm not sure if they'd gossip together. It seems more like something they'd do with their other friends. Clint for example, probably knows everything that goes down in the mansion, and makes a special effort to share with Steve the kinds of things he just. doesn't. want. to know about.
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Tony: Really, Steve, there are lots of incredibly well engineered European and Japanese bikes. Harley Davison and Indian are not the be all and end all of motorcycle manufacturing, especially given that Indian went out of business almost sixty years ago.
Steve: Blasphemer!
Tony: There have been all kinds of advances in the past half century. Better shock absorbers, more efficient carburetors, synthetic brake pads-
Steve: We've been over this. You are not putting rear brakes on my flathead. It's a classic. Joe Petrali set a world land speed record on a bike just like it, back when I was a kid.
Tony: That was in 1937! I could make it go much faster than 136.183 mph. What if I told you I could make it fly?
Steve: That's what I borrow Fury's cars for.
*pause* Tony: Did you know Petreli was the flight engineer on the first and only flight of the Spruce Goose?
Steve: *thinks* Ha! You changed the subject. I won!
My pet fanon is that they've also got a long-running Jefferson vs. Hamilton debate that they've been carrying on for years, and also an ongoing argument over Teddy Roosevelt's anti-trust policies, Tony from the perspective of someone who fanboys Andrew Carnegie and U.S. Steel with a great and holy passion, and Steve as a die-hard Union Democrat.
Edited to fix my typos.
Re: CSI and Grey's Anatomy apparantly ;-)
This debate is happening in my head right now, and it is so canon. The best part is when Hank McCoy wades in.
Steve: We've been over this. You are not putting rear brakes on my flathead. It's a classic. Joe Petrali set a world land speed record on a bike just like it, back when I was a kid.
At which point Tony rolls out the bike that HE broke the land speed record on. Last month.
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I love this scene in "Three Times Steve and Tony had Sex". *grins* It made me a bit sad that I don't know even a tenth as much U.S. history as I would need to to write something similar. I'll just have enjoy it when it appears in yours and
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Seriously? That surprises me, for some reason. Possibly only because I've never watched soccer, so I don't know much about the game.
I'm convinced that SI has season tickets and a corporate box for everything.
Of course! If for no other reason than taking people to games like this is pretty common for corporate negotiations and networking at his level.
Steve likes to sit with the great unwashed and they alternate dragging each other to the corporate/democratic sports experience.
And Tony likes to be able to have sex in the middle of the game if it's going slowly. *snickers* But yeah, I can so see them dragging each other to the different experiences. :-)
Also, awesome list of topics! I am so going to be coming back to this post regularly. *g* Now if only I already knew more about these topics. O.o It's going to be hard for me to write casual dialogue for them, I know it. I don't imagine they have all that many conversations about creative writing, geology, museum operations and ideology, or the Tour de France. *g*
They'd definitely discuss them, but I'm not sure if they'd gossip together. It seems more like something they'd do with their other friends. Clint for example, probably knows everything that goes down in the mansion, and makes a special effort to share with Steve the kinds of things he just. doesn't. want. to know about.
Hmmmm. Yeah, that feels right. Especially the part about Clint. *g*
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Soccer is very strategic. It's not as flashy as say basketball, and certainly there's less scoring, but it's non-stop motion. Displays of impressive athleticism are the rule, but again, nothing flashy as in basketball. I was surprised that it's supposed to be Tony's favourite sport as well, but I'm not sure why. Maybe because it's just not on the radar of many Americans.
And Tony likes to be able to have sex in the middle of the game if it's going slowly.
Ha! So true.
Honestly? I could see these two talking about almost anything. They're both intelligent guys with lots of life experience, and broad interests. They also both like a good, friendly debate. So you could totally have them talk about the Tour de France, or anything you like. Steve is kind of a closet, proto-geek. He has the potential for bringing as many tidbits of seemingly useless information to the table, as do Tony and Reed. Just about different subjects. He's like... the geek that wasn't - he's got the baseline traits that make up a geek, but he doesn't seem to have gotten overly fannish about anything (aside from his shield, America and possibly art), as Tony is about machines, and Reed is about SCIENCE!
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Huh. That reminds me a little bit of cycling and, specifically, the Tour de France. Most people don't realize that cycling is actually a team sport, and that there's a huge amount of strategy involved.
And then you mentioned the TdF in the next paragraph and I swear I didn't read that first. *g*
Steve is kind of a closet, proto-geek.
*laughs* Best sentence ever! But I do see what you mean. Of course, this makes me want to find something that Steve could believeably be outright geekish about. *g*
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Maybe a particular artist?
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What else? *ponders* Music? I can see him being a geek about certain music.
CSI and Grey's Anatomy apparantly ;-)
Re: CSI and Grey's Anatomy apparantly ;-)
Re: CSI and Grey's Anatomy apparantly ;-)
But making out with Steve for flimsy reasons is much more fun. *g*
Re: CSI and Grey's Anatomy apparantly ;-)
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ifwhen we watch Jerry Springer. We avoid MTV, and are surprisingly fond of the Military and Speed channels, as well as the Discovery and History channels. We decided they watched Ninja Warrior when they could, too. And Top Gear, just because Tony would laugh and be horrified whenever they light a car on fire (or anything, ever, and it happens once an episode usually), and Steve would love both the show and Tony's reactions.What I've been trying to figure out is how Tony introduces Steve to porn. Or when. My friends seem to think it was pretty quickly, but I insist that Tony's not that shallow and he understands what is important, and how much of a culture-shock that would be. But you know he'd do it eventually. I have this crack-y idea that Tony starts with hetero porn, and Steve, who's been harboring a secret love for Tony, starts angsting because it's reaffirming that Tony's ohsohetero. And then Tony eventually clues in, probably because of Jan (or maybe Logan, because why not?), and then there's angst-reducing sex. And then Tony shows Steve his stash of gay porn.
Wow, I got off-topic.
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Hey, that's a good idea! I don't watch that much TV, but I could still use TV as a mental springboard for myself. :-)
Also, that's an awesome set of friends. *g* Mine will listen to me babble, but they aren't into the guys the way I am, so there's no give and take, really, just audience.
And Top Gear, just because Tony would laugh and be horrified whenever they light a car on fire (or anything, ever, and it happens once an episode usually), and Steve would love both the show and Tony's reactions.
*laughs* OMG, yes! This gave me the best mental images. *grins*
What I've been trying to figure out is how Tony introduces Steve to porn. Or when. My friends seem to think it was pretty quickly, but I insist that Tony's not that shallow and he understands what is important, and how much of a culture-shock that would be.
I honestly don't think Steve is that conservative/repressed, and porn did exist in the 30's and 40's! I'm confident that not only has he seen plenty of it (he was in the Army), but also that he has a small and tasteful stash of his own.
I could see Tony, in an established relationship with Steve, introducing him to the idea of them enjoying porn together, as a couple, though.
Wow, I got off-topic.
Discussion of porn is never off topic! *grins*
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Fury: *waves handful of photos about proudly, smirking*
Steve: Oh my God. Tell me those people aren't doing what I think they're doing with a lit cigar and a goat.
Bucky: What are they doing? Can I see?
Steve: No. I wish I hadn't.
Dugan: *aside to Fury* When do you think he'll figure out you're going out and finding that stuff just to shock him?
Fury: About the time Hitler surrenders.
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